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Monday, 2 February 2015

Worldlies Outs & Bastards

All of the above names have been used by leaders of the PBCC/Hales Exclusive Brethren to describe or summarise their ex fellow members.

Dr Kate Granger campaigns not to be treated merely as a number or just a body. She wants all National Health Service patients to be greeted by named personnel and acknowledged as a person, so that individual care and compassion can be part of the interaction between medical staff and patients. Her plea has been acknowledged by the UK Health Minister, Jeremy Hunt, and is beginning to take hold throughout the NHS.

Many would like the Plymouth Brethren Christian Church to learn from Dr Granger's campaign. The PBCC should do away with name-calling ('worldlies') and start to treat all non-Brethren people courteously as individuals, so that appropriate care and concern can be offered instead of rigid and damaging social separation. 


18 comments:

  1. In August 1970, James Taylor Jnr talked about how ex-Brethren were afflicted by the plague and he called the Open Brethren "order of the bums". I wrote to a member of the PBCC about this ministry, but received no reply. Perhaps the PBCC hasn't repudiated it.


    READING AT NEW YORK August 5 1970, pages 168-169

    Numbers 16: 41-50

    J .T.Jr. Paul says, what was written aforetime was written for us. Well, these Old Testament scriptures and all the others are for us. It says, there's wrath gone out from Jehovah: the plague is begun. I think this alludes to the current time when God's wrath has gone out, and it's a plague. It means all these persons that have left us, the plague is in them, and it's related to the wrath of God. It doesn't stop until it's directed to stop. So everything is under divine direction here. The plague starts, and then finishes under directions. So this plague amongst us won't cease till direction comes.

    Ques. How does priestly activity affect it?

    J.T.Jr. Well, it's part of the administrative side under God. And so they act without direction, they're not told what to do. But it shows how close they are to God. God doesn't tell 'em what to do. But it's through them that the plague stops. And it won't stop till then.

    Ques. Do you mean to say that this current matter has just not come up overnight, but the Lord is searching out something that's been hidden?

    J.T.Jr. Yes. Well, the previous chapters show that. The whole chapter 15, it's very fine, God speaking about His purposes, but the underlying matter was this condition, which you can say is open brethrenism, O.B.s. Yes, they're order of the bums, I think!

    J .T.Jr. Oh yes, that's O.B.s, order of the bums!

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  2. Wasn't it around this time that J.T.Jr. continued his distinctive ministry regarding bums? I believe he made several references to the bottom line during his inspiring ministry at Aberdeen.

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  3. The audio recording of the goings on at Aberdeen can be found here:

    http://wikipeebia.com/library/audio/

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  4. NHS Kate dear being a bit PC is really the truth of the matter.
    Well not that it's going to worry most normal people who have considerably
    more morals and common sense than the writer of this worthless article.

    A Service provider for the Service user and nothing else.

    Out of felly and no telly



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    1. Would you mind telling us who or what you are referring to here? I genuinely would like to know.

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    2. Is Telly Felly filled with the spirit and speaking in tongues?

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    3. Ian I was as mystified and stunned as you clearly were when I read Out of felly and no telly comment at 2 February at 22:03.

      I can only assume he/she is referring to Kate Granger when mention is made of ‘Kate’ and the ‘NHS’ must refer to the National Health Service.

      However, the rest of the comments are disconnected from any kind of factual detail or sensibility or common decency or respect for fellow human persons

      Kate Granger is a terminally ill cancer patient who is also a doctor. She is simply campaigning for those looking after terminally ill persons in the NHS to have a more personal ‘named’ approach to patients. The campaign is called ‘Hello my name is..” and its detailed in this BBC News article

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-31062042

      The comments from ‘Out of felly and no telly’ bear no relation to the facts at all.

      That is common practice of Plymouth Brethren Christian Church Exclusive Brethren, to base rules, edicts and extremist sectarian inhuman views on baseless assumptions with no factual support to generate a fear culture of anything outside of their group. They have formed most of their extra biblical rules in that manner.

      ‘Out of felly and no telly’ should withdraw the comments and apologise, but I doubt that will happen

      R

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    4. I think it's his lack of comprehension about the original changes in the NHS for nurses, doctors etc to introduce themselves as 'Hello, my name is ...' instead of the apparent remoteness many of us have experienced over the years.

      Again is shows how out of contact with society the members of the PBCC are. They exist in their own little bubble not realising that while God does not change, society and culture does.

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    5. 'A Service provider for the Service user and nothing else'.

      Sounds like the Rapid Relief Team of Fire Engine Chasers, Dire Choirs and wannabe Chefs.

      Out of felly, HD Plasma telly

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  5. "It's all lies!!! " The EBs screech. Sadly it is not. Just have a listen!

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  6. When we took my elderly grandmother a transcript of the Aberdeen meetings she said "Lies, all lies!" That was the last conversation we had, and later we found out she had died.

    Could Leonardo, Granny, Patmos, whoever, let me know the current 'position' on the recording and the transcript. Is it 'lies, all lies' and I have quite wrongly been feeling bitter against the PBCC for years? I need to know so I can lay some old feelings to rest.

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  7. a bum is a begger. someone in poverty. persons who forsook JTjr at the end of his life were left in poverty. they lost all spiritual life. the evidence of this is clear! nothing wrong with him using that word. the plague has continued. look at UBT. causing distress to the brethren. BDH is a bum.

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    1. Anon 3rd Feb 07:10

      You say – “persons who forsook JTjr at the end of his life were left in poverty. they lost all spiritual life. the evidence of this is clear”

      Please explain what you mean ?

      Are you aware that –

      James Taylor Junior (JT Jnr) was the leader of the Exclusive Brethren (PBCC) from 1959 to 1970. His father (the previous leader James Taylor Senior), had set a poor example because he liked a whisky tipple when at meetings. James Taylor Junior was already a confirmed alcoholic when he took the leadership in 1959.

      In any decent Christian Church following the Bible, the fact JTjnr was already an alcoholic would prevent him from taking a leadership position because he would not meet the qualifications as laid out in the Holy Scriptures, but the Brethren ignored Biblical instruction.

      JT Jnr was admitted to a drying out clinic in 1964/5, yet the Brethren still ignored Biblical instruction to remove him from leadership. From 1959 to 1970 JT Jnr introduced many whimsical fanciful false doctrines to the Brethren. These doctrines were based on twisting the Word of God and ignoring the contextual setting and original application and meaning. These false doctrines were also often based on cherry picking one verse out of context to others. Despite the Biblical instruction to refute, challenge and reject false teaching, the Brethren still did not remove JTjnr.

      In 1970 in the UK in Preston and Aberdeen JT Jnr was witnessed on stage drunk and inebriated while taking supposed Christian meetings. He used foul and base language not in keeping with Christianity and slurring his words while toying with and joking about the Holy Scriptures. He was witnessed fondling sisters hair and stroking them in Preston UK and was found in bed with another mans wife in Aberdeen UK. The two UK events in 1970 caused a massive split and division in the Brethren.

      All of the above is not rumour but can be read about in printed transcripts of ministry, personal letters, witness statements, recordings and media articles.

      Anon 3rd Feb 07:10

      Are you seriously suggesting that those who rejected JT Jnr have “lost all spiritual life” ?

      Yes I agree that the Bruce Hales system with business, ubt etc is wrong, and that JT Jnr was right to say “commerce has no place in the assembly” but JT Jnr was not “spiritual life”, JT jnr was a proven false teacher, just look at the “no eating” doctrine and other 'separation' fancies

      “Spiritual life” is found by following Gods Word in the Bible, it is found “In Christ” not in a mere man in the flesh and certainly not in an alcoholic womaniser who introduced unscriptural false teaching and who was found in bed with another mans wife.

      R

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    2. Has Mr Noakes joined us?

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    3. I think that rather then me making assumptions of DN (I have only heard good of him) search for www.paulsgladtidings.info and get the facts directly from him.

      I hear that the assembly in South Africa is glued to DN and love him greatly, a stark contrast to the Bruce Business Group.

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    4. I have only heard good of both DN and JT Jnr from those who have known him. All men have come short of the glory of God, JT knew that if he admitted anything the people that where evil and legal in the room would have had him withdrawn from (being drunk, calling someone a bum and being next to a naked person may be sin but is not evil to withdraw. Peter did far worse and denied being with Christ 3 times and did not loose his place or the Holy Ghost).

      As I say DN seems to have a happy following in South Africa, they also have a site where you can make contact and hear where he stands from his own mouth: www.paulsgladtidings.info.

      I just think half these people here are very legal against JT Jnr and left more because they hated him then because of the two bad incidents that happened, which are forgivable and I may add that God never removes someone from his post for one or two major fallings, especially since the blood covers sin.

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  8. I've been thinking about how upsetting it must be for kind and courteous PBCC members that they have to separate from non-Brethren people. It must be painful to refuse an invitation to share a cup of tea with a neighbour or not to be free to welcome a non-Brethhren family member to lunch, supper or an overnight stay. Good manners and hospitality matter and it must shrivel the hearts of decent people in the PBCC that they're obliged to behave in this unfriendly way.

    Jessie Crosland was a daughter of the EB world leader, F E Raven, and the mother of the British government Cabinet Minister, Tony Crosland. In the 1960s Mrs Crosland was expelled from the Exclusive Brethren for refusing to denounce a fellow member. Her daughter-in-law wrote this about what happened:


    When she was in her seventies, his mother was visited one evening by three elders of the Exclusive Brethren. At a previous Sunday meeting, a member of the Brethren was driven out for some deviation from doctrine, denounced as a moral leper, son of Belial. Mrs Crosland refused to join in the denunciation. The elders came to her flat, where she lived alone, to persuade her to accept their judgment. She refused. So they chucked her out too.

    ‘It was very unpleasant sometimes,’ she recalled when she was in her nineties or thereabouts. ... ‘I’m glad now, because the Brethren since then have become Taylorites - that American, you know. They’ve gone downhill. But at the time it happened, I was sometimes very unhappy.’ On Highgate Hill when she met members of the Brethren whom she’d known most of her life, they put their hands behind their backs.

    (From ‘Tony Crosland’ by Susan Crosland, Coronet Books: Hodder & Stoughton 1982/3, page 220.)

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  9. "Out of felly, HD Plasma telly"

    Ha ha, I spluttered into my cornflakes over this!

    Out of felly, more than one telly, and clearly bound for helly!

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